We have big news, maybe in the case of the
death of Trump friend in sex traffic or Jeffrey Epstein who died under what I admit are strange
and unusual circumstances while in jail awaiting trial in what was called a suicide, but quite
frankly it sounded odd from day one even without jumping into any particular conspiracy theory,
the New York chief medical examiner ruled the death a suicide by hanging back in August. There is this well known forensic pathologist
named Michael Bodden who’s been appearing on television for decades. I remember watching
him on Larry King when I was a kid in the late nineties and he was interviewed by the
folks over at Fox and friends and he says, the evidence that he has reviewed is more
indicative of homicide than suicide. Now I want to look at pieces of this because while
I agree that there are weird things about the Epstein death, I’m going to be totally
transparent with you. I’m not fully in on the conspiracy theory side. I’m not fully
in on the official story. Make sense to me. I don’t know what happened, but I want us
to be savvy and critical consumers of any assertion that we see in the media. And there
is a lot of stuff here that if you actually pick it apart, doesn’t make a lot of sense.
So let’s start with the first segment from Fox and friends. Well, I was asked by the brother the next
of kin to be at the autopsy and at the autopsy on day one, they were findings that were unusual
for suicidal hanging and more consistent with a ligature, homicidal and strangulation, which
included, and it was suggested at the time that he committed suicide by doing what? But
by hanging at the time, who was found allegedly hanging by a homemade ligature of sheets.
Are you saying you don’t think it was suicide? I think that the evidence points toward homicide
rather than suicide because there are multiple three fractures in the hyoid bone, the thyroid
cartilage that are very unusual for suicide and more, uh, indicative of strangulation,
homicidal strangulation. So Bodden says that the autopsy he observed,
it was inconclusive, whether it was homicide or suicide initially. And then it was later
changed and it’s unclear why and that’s a lot of the focus here, but that’s not really
evidence of anything and it’s important to understand that. Also, a lot of the framing
of this interview is off. Brian Kilmeade frames this like Bodon is like working a charity
case here. He says, how did you learn the family needed your help? It’s important to
understand that Michael Bodden was hired by Jeffrey Epstein’s brother. He’s in the employ
of Jeffrey Epstein. This is not a charity case and your entire understanding of what
Michael Bodden says is different if you see him as the good Samaritan with decades of
expertise showing up to help out someone in need versus he’s involved because he was hired
for money, presumably as far as we would be allowed to assume by one of the parties that
is involved. You have to take that into account. Let’s continue. So you say when you left the
examination room, there were assure what happened? That’s right. So what, you know, this procedure,
what happened the interim to get this so, so such a blunt conclusion? Well, a week later it was changed to homicide.
The brother wants to know what did they get new in that week to make it homicide? What’s
your answer to that? We don’t know. We don’t know. It’s 80 days now. Right. And the brothers
feels he’s getting a run around. And to add to it, there was a total breakdown in security.
The video cameras didn’t work, the guards went to sleep. Okay. And then, so this is sort of a key thing.
These broken bones are much at issue and later he’s asked if he’s ever seen fractured bone
bones in the hyoid or a thyroid, I think. What would the thyroid, it’s called something
else, maybe a a fracture or a or a damage to it in a self-inflicted death. How hard is it to commit suicide in prison?
A very easy and but first in this situation, a who or if he took the sheets and stripped
and made, it would have taken a good half hour or hour to make the ligature than to
go up there. And once you’re hanging, it’s about five minutes or so that you can have
been near dead. Dr Bowden though, if you know, if it, you know, the, the supposition is that
it was homicide, that would mean cops were in, in on it. Uh, you know, who opened the
door, who moved the cameras, all of that stuff. That, that’s it. That’s right. Well, terrible
allegations. Well, th th why were the two guard to guard, to sleep in 50 years of looking
deaths in New York state. Then occasionally a guard falls asleep, never had two guards
at the same time. The cell, the, the camera in the cell watching didn’t work. The cavern in the hallway to see if anybody
came in and out of his cell didn’t work. This is bizarre that his roommate was taken away.
So he’s all by himself. Suicide watch was taken away. So yeah, the issue you bring up
has to be invested. Doesn’t mean that this is a homicide, right. But certainly deserves
investigation. And the brother is concerned. There is no investigation scene. Anyone that
committed suicide and one was hanging themselves with those three broken bones. No hanging
does not cause these uh, uh, broken bones and homicide does usually two bro, two bounds.
Even three is a huge amount of pressures. It was applied. So listen, I don’t know what to think. Okay.
If we step back for a second, Michael Bodden was hired by Epstein’s brother so that that
has to be taken into account here. Fox and friends then has a further interest in perpetuating
the most sensational and salacious possible version of the story. But at the same time,
even people in our audience who are not prone to conspiratorial thinking, email me every
few days and say, David, something here doesn’t seem right. There are too many coincidences.
He was on suicide watch and then taken off and then the cameras go down and the guards
fall asleep and he ends up with broken bones that never get broken in a hanging suicide.
But, and this is what we all should be doing. You’ve got to start looking at these claims
one by one because a lot of times without taking a side, I want to be clear. I don’t know what happened. A lot of times
when you hear all these facts together, it’s like, wow, yeah, that clearly something else
happened. But you got to break them down. One by one. An example Bodden says, part of
the suspicious thing is he was on suicide watch and then he was taken off of it. That’s
not really a part of the story. His own lawyers, Epstein’s own lawyers asked for him to be
removed from suicide watch. Uh, conditions are not as good in suicide watch, uh, when
you were on suicide watch at this particular facility. So that’s not really part of what
we’re looking at. His own lawyer said, take them off of suicide watch. Then there’s the
claim. He says, I’ve never seen those bones broken in a suicide. Well, hold on a second.
I did a very Googling and found a study called, and there’s many of these fractures of the
hyoid bone and thyroid cartilage and suicidal hanging, which says that in this study, in
25% of the cases reviewed, there were fractures of the hyoid bone in known a hanging suicides. So when Michael Bodden says, I’ve never seen
this, well here’s a study that says it happens a quarter of the time. It’s not proof of anything,
but again, when he says he’s never seen it and that feels overwhelming to us, and then
we say, well, hold on, here’s an actual peer reviewed study which says it’s not that rare.
This one says it’s happened in a quarter of the times. There are other studies which say
it’s even more common that you see fractures of the hyoid bone even in a suicidal hanging.
So I don’t know what happened. I’m not proporting to tell you what happened. I have an open
mind and a lot of this does seem weird and on motive. There are lots of people who would
want Epstein dead. All I’m saying is when you hear the bullet points rattled off camera,
broken bones, suicide watch, it sounds overwhelming and uncontestable, but when you start breaking
it down and looking at each piece one by one, a lot of these things can be crossed off.
They can be crossed off as proof or disproof. They sort of become not particularly relevant
factors. And then you maybe can get a more sober and sensible assessment of what went
on. We may still never know what ultimately happened, but it’s important to take every
single assertion with the same skepticism that I hope I have inspired people to have
about any messages we hear in media looting. Those of you here, here on the David
package, let me know what you think. I’m on Twitter at D Pacman and the show is on Twitter
at David Pakman show